Television Interview, NEWS24

SUBJECTS: Remembrance Day; Eleven Australian Soldiers Identified More Than A Century After The First World War; Defence Estate Audit; US Midterm Elections

PETE STEFANOVIC, HOST: And the Defence Minister joins us now. Richard Marles, hello to you. So, let's just start off more broadly on Remembrance Day. It's an important day on our calendar as well as around the world, too. What does it mean to you, particularly as Defence Minister?

RICHARD MARLES, ACTING PRIME MINISTER: Well, it's the day that we remember the 103,000 Australians who have lost their lives wearing our nation's uniform, and in remembering them to acknowledge and give gratitude to all of those who have worn our nation's uniform in the past and who wear it today. There is something extraordinary about putting that uniform on, because 103,000 Australians, they never took it off. It was the last thing they did. And that says something about the degree of sacrifice involved in service. People are literally putting their lives on the line to defend and protect our way of life. And today is the day to remember that, but also to be incredibly grateful for the work and service they provide.

STEFANOVIC: Let's get to this fantastic story. You know, these 11 soldiers who now have names, no longer unknown soldiers. I've been to some of these ceremonies in the past on the Western Front, and, you know, the DNA sampling, the work that goes into it is just extraordinary. Can you just elaborate on these 11 soldiers? And one of them you have a link to?

MARLES: Well, one of them is my great uncle, Lieutenant Andrew Anderson. And I was notified a few weeks ago that I was one of the descendants, the next of kin of Lieutenant Andrew Anderson. And after more than a century, as you say, of being in the Hooge Crater Cemetery in Belgium. He's rested under an unknown soldier's headstone for more than a century. And as you said, there will be now a ceremony where that will be changed. But, I mean, it's an incredible story. It feels very personal, obviously, to me, but this is something that's played out for 11 other families around Australia. That's a large number. In any given year, it's normally around four or five. But the Army's Unrecovered War Casualties Unit does this work to this day, trying to identify Australian soldiers who have not been previously identified. Of the 103,000 who have lost their lives, 23,000 remain unidentified. The bulk of them are from the First World War. But Reverend Gaenor Berkin, she's in Scotland, is very passionate about this. It's been her life's work to try and identify soldiers. She happened to come across my great uncle's case in 2020. After painstaking research that she undertook, she wrote to the Unrecovered War Casualties Unit of the Australian Army to say she believed that she'd been able to identify Andrew Anderson. And that in turn set off an inquiry from that unit. Major Lachlan Newham, who I've now had an opportunity to speak with, who did the work in Australia, verified this research. And actually, this was a matter of painstakingly comparing records. There wasn't any DNA in my great uncle's case, but they have been able to identify that the person in this plot is in fact, my great uncle. And it's an incredible story.

STEFANOVIC: Yeah. And did you know much about him in the past? Did you know, you know, where he was fighting, how he died, etc?

MARLES: Yeah, look, it's a good question. On my mother's side, we knew more of that First World War history, and that's partly because they survived. My grandfather, who I knew, fought on the Western Front, he fought at Pozieres and won a Military Cross. And so I was much more aware of his service. As it turned out, Andrew Anderson, who was on my father's side of the family, was at Pozieres as well, was mentioned in dispatches. So, what I knew was that my grandmother, who I knew as well, that was his sister, had a photo of Andrew in her house and it was very precious to her, but I didn't really know much more than that. What I've since learnt, having gone through his records, is that he joined at the age of 19. That meant that he needed the consent of his parents, my great grandparents, to enlist at that age. He enlisted as a private, very quickly rose through the ranks, which must have been an incredible experience for him as a young man. He served in Gallipoli, he was at Pozieres. He was promoted to Lieutenant less than two weeks before he died. And you read his records, and it is a record of service, but also a record of achievement. And, you know, I think about what that whole experience must have been like for him as a young adult. And then tragically, he loses his life instantaneously. And now, more than a century later, you know, I feel enormously proud of him, of his service and the fact that we can remember him in this way

STEFANOVIC: I just love the work that's done into all of this, you know, giving these unknown soldiers a name. And he's finally getting the recognition from a personal point of view, from what he's done. Fighting, ultimately dying for this country, but fighting for this country. I think that's a great story. Minister, just to some other issues before we go, because I know you're busy, that being the main story today, Remembrance Day, but you've of course been in the news lately, your attempts to sell Victoria Barracks, which has now been reversed. Do you think you've lost respect from parts of the defence community over this?

MARLES: Well, I mean, others can make their commentary on that. What I know is that my job each and every day is to provide for the defence of the country. And the idea that we are spending hundreds of millions of dollars on sites around the country that we're not using is just not tenable. I mean, every person who wears our uniform today matters. Every hour that they put in counts and every dollar which supports them is precious. And the idea that we would be spending a couple of hundred million dollars on Victoria Barracks Sydney alone over the next 10 years to maintain that site as a defence site, that wouldn't need to be spent if it's not a defence site, where that money could be spent on making our Army more amphibious, providing long-range fires to our Army, making it much more capable. I mean, it is really clear that we need to be walking down this path. The Defence Estate Audit was damning in its assessment of the way in which the defence estate has been managed over decades. And it made clear that a failure to make difficult decisions had left the Army with the burden that it has today.

STEFANOVIC: But you were on this program just with me just a couple of weeks ago, Minister, and you were strident that the sale wouldn't happen. So, what happened? Were you rolled by the PM in the end?

MARLES: Well, what matters here, I think, is that this no longer will form part of the Defence estate –

STEFANOVIC: So you were wrong?

MARLES: Well, we work through with the Prime Minister and others what the future of the site would be, and not just this site, but other sites. That it remains in public hands is a good outcome. But this is a site which is going to be protected by law in terms of the heritage listing of it. That it remains in public hands is an additional layer to that to make sure that the stories of this site are maintained.

STEFANOVIC: You were overruled. That's what happened, isn't it?

MARLES: Well, what we have done Pete, the fundamental point here is that we are implementing the Defence Estate Audit and this will no longer be maintained as a defence estate and that hundreds of millions of dollars to maintain it as a defence site will not be spent and can be focused elsewhere.

STEFANOVIC: Well, what are you going to do with those properties?

MARLES: Well what we have said is that they will be maximised in terms of community and commercial use. It's probably important to understand that because of the heritage –

STEFANOVIC: How so, what commercial use?

MARLES: Well, that'll be worked through in the coming months and years. But the heritage overlay of Victoria Barracks Sydney and for that matter Victoria Barracks Melbourne, Fort Queenscliff and Point Cook was such that the commercial value of those was actually not as much as people would imagine. We will look for commercial opportunities, but I think the really important thing here is Victoria Barracks Sydney is now going to be opened up to all Australians and to all Sydneysiders. We're commissioning the Australian War Memorial to tell the stories of this site in a bigger and better way with a much larger audience. That is a much, much better heritage outcome. And right now most members of the Australian Army are not able to go to Victoria Barracks Sydney. Most members of the Australian Army have never been to Victoria Barracks Sydney. That will all change. And so this is better for the ADF, it's a much better heritage outcome. And in terms of, you know, acknowledging the service and all that has occurred at that site and that great history which lies within it, this is an outcome which will see those stories told to a much wider audience and Sydneysiders will get to enjoy this incredible place.

STEFANOVIC: Just a final point. Your American counterpart, Pete Hegseth, Minister, he's facing impeachment in the US. There could be a vote within hours. Have you got a thought on that and what that means for our relationship, US-Australia, on a number of defence deals?

MARLES: Well, look, I mean that's obviously a matter that will play out in the United States and it's fundamentally a matter for the United States. We work very closely with the administration of the day and I have worked very closely with Pete Hegseth and in terms of all our very significant equities with the United States, AUKUS as an example, you know, all of that is proceeding at a pace. The USS Colorado, a US Virginia-class submarine, is in Perth right now. I'm heading over there in the next day or so to see it. It's undergoing a significant maintenance period there. We're getting ready for the Submarine Rotational Force-West, which will commence at HMAS Stirling at the end of next year. Again, all of that is on track. AUKUS is happening, our alliance is happening and all of that continues unimpeded.

STEFANOVIC: Regardless of what happens to Pete Hegseth in the hours and days ahead?

MARLES: Yeah, I mean we continue to manage our relationship and we're managing it well and, you know, American processes will take their path and that's a matter for them.

STEFANOVIC: All right, that's the Defence Minister Richard Marles on the program this morning, the Acting Prime Minister as well and once more I'm pleased and happy for you that you've had a little more light shone on your family and his part in our great war effort from World War I. So, thank you so much to you, Minister.

MARLES: Thanks Pete.

ENDS