Television Interview, Sky News

SUBJECTS: Australian-China relationship; AUKUS; Australia-US relationship

PETER STEFANOVIC, HOST: Joining us live now, Acting Prime Minister Richard Marles. Good to see you this morning, Richard. So what does that really say about our relationship, when there’s all this talk about stabilisation? It doesn’t feel as though it’s stabilised. 

RICHARD MARLES, ACTING PRIME MINISTER: Well, I think the relationship is stabilised, but that doesn’t mean there aren’t challenges within the relationship, and we’ve been very upfront about them and very clear about them in the conversations that we’ve had with China, and that’s reflected in the issues that the Prime Minister raised with President Xi and the comments that the Prime Minister has been making. I mean, the relationship with China is complex and it is difficult- it has challenges, but it also has opportunities. It is our largest trading partner. But the fundamental point, Pete, is it’s a relationship which benefits from engagement, and that’s why we do that. 

STEFANOVIC: Sure. 

MARLES: And it’s important that we are having that engagement. 

STEFANOVIC: Can they – can China be trusted? 

MARLES: Well, I mean, we operate in our national interest, and we work with China on the basis of trying our best to understand what they are doing in respect of their national interest. But what I know is that in building engagement and in building communication you improve levels of trust, and that’s important. And it’s particularly important when times are challenging. 

STEFANOVIC: The Port of Darwin, it was not brought up in the conversation, perhaps convenient for both parties. Does that mean a sale will proceed now, Richard? 

MARLES: Well, we’ve made it clear that we- well, we opposed the sale of the Port of Darwin by the former Coalition government all those years ago when it occurred, the and the Prime Minister and, indeed, Labor has been very consistent about this ever since then. And we want to see the Port of Darwin brought back into Australian hands. And that is the course that we are pursuing and investigating and what we will seek to happen. And we’ll continue to work with the parties, work with the Northern Territory government to achieve that end. 

STEFANOVIC: Now that the Prime Minister has met Xi Jinping – and there’s pressure building on this; you know that – when will Prime Minister Albanese meet President Donald Trump? 

MARLES: Look, I’m sure that meeting is going to happen in the not-too-distant future. You know this, of course, that the Prime Minister has spoken with the President on a number of occasions by phone-

STEFANOVIC: No recent meeting, though. 

MARLES: Sure, and, I mean, there was a meeting scheduled but events happened in the Middle East. And a number of meetings with world leaders happened – did not go ahead on that day- you know, events occur. But I’ve got no doubt that in the not-too-distant future you’ll see a face-to-face meeting between the Prime Minister and the President. 

STEFANOVIC: Okay. Let’s get into your defence space then. In recent months – and I’ve just gone through Elbridge Colby’s social media channels – he’s met a range of leaders from a range of countries in our region, including South Korea, Philippines, even Papua New Guinea last month. When was the last time that you were able to have a conversation with him? 

MARLES: With Elbridge Colby? 

STEFANOVIC: Yeah. 

MARLES: Is that the question? 

STEFANOVIC: That’s the question. 

MARLES: Well, I’ve been talking with Elbridge Colby’s boss, and that’s the Secretary of Defense, Pete Hegseth. I mean, that’s – 

STEFANOVIC: But this guy is leading the AUKUS review. 

MARLES: Sure, and it’s a review which is happening within the Department of Defense in the US, within the Pentagon. And my counterpart is the Secretary of Defense, Elbridge Colby’s boss, and he is the person who I have engaged with and the answer to that question would be, you know, I’ve met with Pete Hegseth on a couple of occasions and spoken extensively with him about our relationship, including AUKUS. 

STEFANOVIC: So has there – so when Elbridge Colby is meeting all these guys, does he make any attempt to talk to you, or you just don’t bother about him? You go straight to Hegseth? 

MARLES: Well, we engage with the Pentagon and we engage with – people within the Australian Department of Defence engage with their counterparts in the Pentagon, and that includes Elbridge Colby. But, you know, my – I engage with my counterpart, and my counterpart is the Secretary of Defense, that’s Elbridge Colby’s boss. And that’s who I’ve spoken with on a number of occasions. 

STEFANOVIC: So I’m just curious – 

MARLES: And, might I say, Pete, that’s how I would – that’s how I’ve always engaged with the United States. That’s how we engage with countries – we speak to our respective counterparts. 

STEFANOVIC: I’m just curious, yeah. He’s just – like, there’s just a lot of action in our region and it appears to be not so much our way. So he’s also posted about Japan overnight here he says, “We at the Department of Defense stand ready to work closely with Tokyo to adjust to this new era and to follow President Trump’s guidance to make our alliances stronger, more equitable and sustainable.” All we seem to be getting, Richard, is will you use US subs to help the US fight China in any raid on Taiwan. Is there not friction between our relationship with the US at the moment? 

MARLES: No, there isn’t. And, I mean, there’s speculation about what you’ve just said then, but our relationship with the United States is as strong as it has ever been. I mean, I’d – you know, Pete, I was the first international counterpart that Pete Hegseth, the Secretary of Defense, met with – the first in the world. And, you know, I met with him again in Singapore at the Shangri-La Dialogue, was involved in a number of engagements with him during the course of that weekend. You know, we’re building a strong rapport, and that’s reflected through the relationship between the entire Australian Department of Defence and the American Department of Defense, and that includes engagement at the right level with Elbridge Colby. And, you know, this review is something which is an important step. Obviously we are taking it very seriously. We welcome it. We get that an incoming government is going to do a review of this kind, and we’ll work with the United States in terms of what we present to that review. 

STEFANOVIC: Yeah, I mean, much was made about Malcolm Turnbull getting some face time with Elbridge Colby, as you mentioned before, before he became the Under Secretary. But when he asks if Australia would be using our subs, you know, in the long term to help the US over Taiwan, knowing that we couldn’t answer, particularly the Prime Minister being in China, do you think he’s deliberately agitating? 

MARLES: No. Look, we have an agreement with the United States, as we do with the United Kingdom, about acquiring a nuclear-powered sovereign capability for Australia. And it’s obviously understood across all three countries that this will be a sovereign Australian asset where the decisions that are made around the use of it in the future will be made by a future Australian government. That said, we have a close relationship – a very close relationship – with both the United States and the United Kingdom which is characterised by cooperation in terms of what we do. And that, in turn, is really understood, which is why both America and Britain see it as in their strategic interests that Australia acquires this capability. So, you know, I mean, a lot is kind of being – there’s been a lot speculated, but the fundamentals here are that we’re talking about three countries who have worked very closely together over decades and decades, and Australia acquiring this capability is in the strategic interests of all three countries. 

STEFANOVIC: Okay, Richard Marles, good to have you with us this morning. Thanks for your time, as always. Chat to you again soon.

ENDS

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