Radio Interview, 3AW Drive

SUBJECTS: G7; Defence Spending; Tariffs; Middle East Conflict. 

JACQUI FELGATE, HOST: On the line now is the Deputy Prime Minister and Defence Minister Richard Marles. Really appreciate your time on what is a very busy day.

RICHARD MARLES, ACTING PRIME MINISTER: Good afternoon, Jacqui, how are you?

FELGATE: Look, I'm well, thank you. So, let's get right into it. So, President Trump's early exit from the G7. Just moments ago he's put out a post on his Truth Social saying that publicity seeking President Emmanuel Macron of France mistakenly said I left the G7 summit in Canada to go back to D.C. to work on a ceasefire between Israel and Iran. Wrong. He has no idea why. I am now on my way back to Washington. It has nothing to do with a ceasefire. So, in terms of Australia's relationship with the US right now, we didn't get the meeting. Where do we go to from here?

MARLES: Well, we have been working very closely with the United States and with this Administration from the moment that it's been sworn in. And indeed, the Prime Minister has spoken with the President on a number of occasions by phone. I've spoken with my counterpart, the Foreign Minister has spoken with hers, the Trade Minister has spoken with his, and our officials continue to work closely with the Administration. And I'm sure that in the not too distant future, we will have a face to face meeting between the two leaders. But I also think that however one wants to characterise it, there is a conflict going on in the world right now which is demanding the attention of the President of the United States. And I think we can all understand why he would be going back to Washington D.C. 

FELGATE: But does it make it difficult, given the Prime Minister has never met with the President face to face?

MARLES: Well, firstly, again, they've spoken on a number of occasions by phone and so a rapport is being established there. But the relationship happens at a whole range of levels and we continue to make the case in respect of all of the equities that we have within the relationship; be it national security, be it the economy, be it tariffs, and all of that proceeds. I mean, in actual fact, I think the relationship between Australia and the United States is in a good place and we fundamentally proceed with a sense of optimism about how our Alliance, how the bilateral relationship will be managed with the Trump Administration. 

FELGATE: Is it in a better place than under the Biden Administration?

MARLES: Well, I mean, we work with all administrations and I think. I mean, sometimes these lines can sound a bit trite, but they are in fact true, that really the depth of the relationship between Australia and America is such that irrespective really of who's been in the White House and who's been in the Lodge, you can draw a really healthy line through the relationship between Australia and America since the Second World War and even before that.

FELGATE: And that continues with respect, though, what about AUKUS, though? That's still a deal that is under review and surely it would have been in our best interest to be able to have that face to face conversation this week.

MARLES: Well, AUKUS is proceeding at a pace. We're working closely on it. The United States is working closely on it. The United States has indicated that they're going to have a review, that's an entirely natural and appropriate thing for an incoming government to do. We welcome it, we'll engage with it. It's what the British Government did when it was elected in July of last year, it undertook a review into AUKUS and reported very positively on it. Really, it's what we did when we were elected back in 2023. We undertook the Defence Strategic Review, which looked at all of our defence posture. But clearly AUKUS was a big part of that and it very much looked at AUKUS at the time. And we engaged with both the US and the UK in undertaking that review and it's helped us in terms of the way in which we've engaged with AUKUS going forward. So, I don't think we should be looking at that as anything other than a really natural step for an incoming government to take and we welcome it.

FELGATE: But on defence and spending, which you just mentioned, like, we're still short of what Washington wants, the 3.5% of GDP, have there been any movements there?

MARLES: Well, firstly, we've increased our defence spending significantly in the last couple of years. We have engaged in the biggest peacetime increase in Australia's defence spending in our history. And that is a fact which is recognised around the world, including in the United States. I mean, what we do when it comes to our defence spending is we assess what our threats are out there and we look at the kind of defence force we need to build in order to meet those threats and then we resource it. And that's the point that the Prime Minister has been making and that's what we do and it's what every country does. And, you know, we get that, you know, countries around the world will benchmark each other on the level of defence spending, but when it comes to the way in which you plan for your own defence spending, it can only be done on the basis of what is our national interest, what kind of capabilities do we need, and then going out there and resourcing them, and we're clearly doing that.

FELGATE: I mean, you've made remarks to this in the past, that we will inevitably be drawn into any US China conflict. So, will we always side with the US?

MARLES: Well, it's not exactly what I've said, but I mean, I think the important point to make is that what we seek to do is to avoid conflict. And what we seek to do is to work with our partners and allies in order to deter conflict. And that's the fundamental point.

FELGATE: But if there was to be a conflict, which side would we take?

MARLES: Well, it's not seeking to, you know, I'm not going to speculate about that. We work with our partners and our allies in order to try and avoid conflict and to deter it. And I think Australians should have a sense of confidence that that is utterly the focus of our government in doing what we do. We are an ally of the United States. That is also clear. You know, we've been in a formal alliance with the United States since 1951, and we continue to in an alliance with the United States. And that Alliance, as I've said on many occasions, is the cornerstone of our strategic and foreign policy.

FELGATE: Are they bullying us, the US?

MARLES: I wouldn't say that at all. I mean, we work closely with the United States in doing what I've just described. I mean, we work with the US when we're talking about national security, we work with the US to try and do everything we can to provide for a stable and peaceful world and a stable and peaceful region in the Indo Pacific. And that's really the focus of the way in which we are engaging with the US we clearly have a different view when it comes to tariffs. We are a country which has a growing proportion of our national income being derived from trade. We've always been a trading nation and so we've always been big advocates for an open global trading environment. And we continue to make that argument to the United States and that is where we stand.

FELGATE: And has there been any movement on the 50 per cent tariffs on Australian steel and aluminium over the past two weeks at all?

MARLES: Well, we continue to make the argument to the US in relation to all of that. I make the point though that across the board where we have the 10 per cent tariff, that's the lowest tariff that the US has implemented of any country in the world. There are a number of countries who are in the same circumstances as us. But I mean, clearly the US has a different view when it comes to this. But we will keep making our view clear as other countries around the world do the same. And it's very important that we do that. When it comes to questions of national security and strategic policy and that defence relationship, we'll continue to work with the US to promote a stable and peaceful Indo Pacific.

FELGATE: Do you ever feel stressed in your job on a personal level- like we're having this chat- I feel like it's very stressful?

MARLES: Well, look, what I would-

FELGATE: You sound stressed. 

MARLES: I mean there are times where I feel stressed. Obviously I don't feel stressed all the time, Jacqui. We do live in a very complex and difficult world. I suppose the sort of sincere way to answer that question is when we came to office back in 2022- and defence as an area of policy exists behind a veil and for good reason. There's no criticism of former governments in relation to that- there's a whole lot of information which is necessarily classified and confidential. And so I knew that if we ever had the opportunity of being the Defence Minister, having been the Shadow for five years, that there would kind of be a moment where there'd be the big reveal, as it were, and that is what occurred. And I guess, you know, what became really clear to me having gone through that is that, you know, the shape of the world is kind of as I imagined it, but perhaps the volume of it is much higher than I appreciated it. And I certainly feel the weight of the responsibility that comes with being in this role at this time, I think all of us really do as part of our government. And so you do definitely get a sense that you're dealing with deeply serious questions. And from an Australian point of view, what we're trying to do is make sure that we maximise our agency, that we build our own self-reliance in the context of the very challenging world that we face. And that's really at the heart of the decisions that we seek to make.

FELGATE: Yeah. And just very finally, sorry, my apologies for not asking this earlier, but on that challenging world, are Australians in Israel and Iran safe? Are there any people that we still need to locate? Have you done that already? And what is Australia's involvement in that?

MARLES: Yeah, so this answer happens at a couple of levels. So, firstly, we obviously have an embassy in both Tehran and in Tel Aviv, and our embassy officials are all accounted for and they're safe, but we will continue to monitor their safety in an ongoing way. More broadly, within the region, we have a small number of Defence Force personnel and again, they are all accounted for and are safe, but in an ongoing way we continue to monitor their safety. Beyond that, there are actually thousands of Australians who are in both Iran and Israel. The airspace above Iran and Israel is closed right now and so our advice to all of them is to seek shelter in place. That's what they need to do and to keep monitoring the Smartraveller website and guidance. Clearly, the travel advice for both Israel and Iran right now is do not travel. And we are looking at preparing prospects for having evacuations when opportunities arise, in other words, when the airspace opens up. So, there's quite a lot of work going on at the moment and we're seeking Australians who are in both countries to register under the Smartraveller website if they are seeking to avail themselves of that. So, we're working quite intensely to look at how we can do that, how we can do those departures in the ‘if and when’ the airspace opens up.

FELGATE: I always appreciate having you on the program, Richard Marles, the Deputy Prime Minister and Defence Minister, thank you.

MARLES: Thanks, Jacqui.

ENDS