Radio Interview, ABC RN Breakfast

Subject/s: Australia’s additional support for Ukraine; NATO Summit; India-Russia relationship; US Presidential election; Visit to the United Kingdom; AUKUS. 

STEVE CANNANE, HOST: Richard Marles, thanks very much for joining us.

RICHARD MARLES, DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER: Pleasure.

JOURNALIST: You've announced a $250 million military assistance package overnight. Does it give Ukraine what it wants?

MARLES: Well, we've been working very closely with the Ukrainian Government about the resources and the assets that it needs in order to continue to prosecute this conflict which of course has been originated by Russia's illegal invasion of Ukraine. We have made clear that this is neither the first or the last package of support that we will make to Ukraine. It is though the largest package that we have to date announced and it focuses on integrated air and missile defence which has been something that Ukraine has been particularly asking for. And indeed the package which I announced in Ukraine back in April also went to that as well. So, it reflects the conversations that we've been having with Ukraine and it reflects the need for Ukraine to be supported at this moment.

JOURNALIST: You just describe it as the largest single military package Australia has delivered so far since the full scale invasion. Why now? Why is this the largest package being delivered at this point in the war?

MARLES: Well, I think this is a moment where it's really important that the world stands with Ukraine. I think all of us understand that this is going to be an enduring and long contest. Certainly that has been the feeling as we've been speaking with member states of NATO and amongst the Indo Pacific Four states who have also been supporting Ukraine. And so we felt that it's important that at this moment we are providing significant support to Ukraine. But as I say, it forms part of an ongoing set of measures of support for Ukraine. It takes our overall military support to $1.1 billion and our overall support to Ukraine to $1.3 billion since this conflict began. We understand that this is going to continue, so we will be there for as long as it takes for Ukraine to resolve this conflict on its terms.

JOURNALIST: You met with President Zelenskyy. What did you talk about?

MARLES: Well, obviously we were able to talk to him about the package and make the announcement and he was very welcoming of it. He was very grateful for the assistance that Ukraine has received from the four of our countries who met with him, given how far we are from Ukraine. And it was not lost on him the significance of that support being provided from such a distance. I think he was also keen to expand Ukraine's relationships with countries in the Indo Pacific and we were certainly encouraging of him to do that. I mean, clearly he also was articulating just how enduring this conflict will be and how important it is that Ukraine is supported so that it is able to win or resolve this conflict on its terms.

JOURNALIST: You've talked this morning about how this conflict is enduring. And Ukraine has now signed long term bilateral security agreements with at least 16 countries as a result of that G7 declaration last year. And last month, Japan became the first non NATO country to sign one of these agreements. Why hasn't Australia signed one of these agreements that guarantee the long term support for Ukraine?

MARLES: Well, we've been continuing to work with Ukraine around the support that we can provide, and we've made clear to Ukraine really from the outset that we would be standing with them for as long as it takes. And so they're completely clear about our intent and our reliability in being able to stand with them throughout the course of this conflict. And that's been reflected in the announcements that we've been making every few months, really in support of Ukraine.

JOURNALIST: But is signing one of those long term bilateral agreements which those 16 other countries have done. Is that something Australia is looking at?

MARLES: Well, as I say in the conversations that we've been having with Ukraine really the focus has been on providing the support, the particular support that Ukraine has been seeking, and obviously at a scale which is meaningful to them, which is what we've been doing. So, I mean, Ukraine has been very satisfied with the way in which we have been engaging with Ukraine. We know that they know we are there for the long term, and we are, and we'll continue to engage with them on that basis.

JOURNALIST: The former US ambassador to NATO, Kurt Volker, told us this week that what was missing at this NATO summit was a plan for victory. Do you agree that the US and the West need to develop a plan for victory?

MARLES: I think it's, but, I mean, it's obviously important that Ukraine is being supported in this moment in a way which enables it to resolve the conflict on its own terms. I think that support is there. I mean, the sense of resolve amongst NATO members and other countries, including ourselves, Korea, Japan, New Zealand, was manifest. And it was clear for everyone about how important this conflict is and what it means for the world. Ukraine is obviously there fighting for its own country, but in so many ways, it's really on the front line on behalf of all of us in fighting for the maintenance of the global rules based order. And that's an order which is very much in the national interest of a country like Australia. And so we all see that. We all understand what's at stake, and I think the support is being provided as a result.

JOURNALIST: This is a crucial moment in the war, as you've noted. And there are real concerns in Ukraine about what a Trump presidency, a potential Trump Presidency might bring. What was the mood that you felt in DC? Is there optimism that Ukraine can still defeat Russia?

MARLES: Oh, certainly. I mean, what there really was, was a sense of resolve. I think that's the word I would use to characterise the mood that has been present during the course of the NATO meeting this week. A resolve to be there on behalf of Ukraine. And that's–

American leadership has been completely central to that and that was very much underpinning all the conversations that we had, all the dialogue that occurred. And clearly, what happens in America over the course of an election year is a matter for the American people so I'm not going to comment on that. But I think there is a sense that there is the requisite resolve there to support Ukraine and an understanding of exactly what's at stake in this conflict.

CANNANE: On RN Breakfast, we're talking to the Deputy Prime Minister and Defence Minister Richard Marles, who's in Washington DC. He's just met with the Ukrainian President, Volodymyr Zelenskyy and also just announced a $250 million military assistance package overnight. Minister, on that day, that awful day earlier this week that a Russian missile struck that children's hospital in Kyiv, Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi was in Moscow hugging the man behind that missile, Vladimir Putin. What did you think when you saw that?

MARLES: Well, I suppose the first point I'd make is that the missile striking the children's hospital in Ukraine was obviously an outrage and we express our condemnation of that, as we do express our condolences to the Ukrainian people for this tragedy. And I had the opportunity to do that personally with President Zelenskyy this morning. I mean, I'm not going to comment on what we've seen in respect of India, but clearly the attack on a children's hospital is deeply unacceptable. And it speaks to the immorality, really, of the invasion that we've seen from Russia and just how important it is for Ukraine to be supported in this moment.

CANNANE: While he was there, Modi agreed to boost trade with Russia at a time when Australia and other allies of Ukraine are trying to cripple Russia's war economy. Do you condemn any country trying to increase trade with Russia at the moment?

MARLES: Well, we are focused very much on supporting Ukraine. We have the sanctions that we have in place in respect of our own engagement with Russia, and that will continue. But our focus is very much in supporting Ukraine in this critical moment. And as I said, I think there was an overwhelming sense resolve throughout the NATO meeting over the last couple of days to maintain that support of Ukraine and to be there to ensure that Ukraine is in a position where it can resolve this conflict on its terms.

CANNANE: But India has agreed to import more oil from Russia. That will fund more missiles that will kill more civilians, and we'll see more episodes like that awful attack on the hospital in Kyiv.

MARLES: Well, again, we condemn that attack, as we have done. And as I say, we continue to support Ukraine. And our position in relation to Russia is absolutely clear.

CANNANE: You're travelling to the UK to meet with the newly appointed UK secretary for state, John Healey. What do you hope to come out of those talks?

MARLES: Well, I look forward to meeting John again. John has been here this week and I've been able to catch up with him briefly over the last couple of days. But the next two days will offer a more fulsome opportunity to have a substantial conversation with him very early on in the life of the new government in Britain. John is somebody I've known over a long period of time, and as the shadow minister for health– for Defence, I'm sorry, we engaged with John around the critical issues which were facing our relationship with Britain. And so we have a real sense of confidence about the support that there is from the new government in relation to AUKUS, for example. But this will be a really good opportunity to talk through in detail the arrangements that we have in place with Great Britain in respect of AUKUS. And that's just a fantastic opportunity early on in life of this government. I mean, the relationship with Great Britain is really central in terms of the delivery of AUKUS, given that what we will be building in Adelaide will be a class of submarine that will be jointly operated by ourselves and Great Britain. And so there are a lot of equities at stake in terms of our relationship with Britain. And I'm really looking forward to the opportunity of spending some time with John.

CANNANE: And just to correct what I said, he is the Secretary of State for Defence, John Healey. Can I just get your views on whether you think British policy will change at all in regarding AUKUS, in regarding Ukraine under a new Labour government?

MARLES: I don't expect to see that. And, I mean, as I said, we've spoken with John prior to the election, over the last couple of years, as we would do in terms of ensuring that there is a bipartisan position of support in Great Britain around AUKUS. And as the shadow minister for defence, he was absolutely giving us that assurance. I'm absolutely confident that that will be the way in which the Starmer government will enact policy in relation to AUKUS going forward, but it's still going to be a really good opportunity to be able to meet and have a fulsome conversation with John in his new role as the, as the minister for defence and I'm really looking forward to that opportunity.

CANNANE: Richard Marles, I'm sure you've had a very busy schedule at the NATO summit. We appreciate you finding the time to talk to us this morning.

MARLES: Pleasure.