Interview with Laura Jayes, Sky News

LAURA JAYES:

This morning thousands of Russian troops amass along the Ukraine border. NATO is sending ships and fighter jets to Eastern Europe. The UK is warning of violent and bloody consequences if the Kremlin invades. The United States has put thousands of its troops on heightened alert and Australia is one of many countries evacuating the families of diplomats and warning against travel to the region.

Joining me live now is the Defence Minister Peter Dutton. Minister, thank you for your time. What is the latest information you have on that situation?

PETER DUTTON:

Good morning Laura. Well, it's a precarious position that the Ukraine finds itself in, to say the least. The Russians have been, I think, quite obvious in their intent. They're amassing troops on the border, their positioning assets and I think Australia, as you would expect, like every other country, wants to see the Russians to step back. They want to see a de-escalation of the pressure that's there at the moment. It would result in tens of thousands of people losing their lives in the Ukraine and to what end? That's the consistent message of the Western world and many others across Europe and many other countries that just don't see any sense in Russia’s positioning and their approach.

LAURA JAYES:

What is Australia's role? Do you expect to be asked by the US or NATO to join any efforts in the future?

PETER DUTTON:

No we don't. As you know Laura, we've got a lot going on in the Indo-Pacific at the moment. S, Australia's responsibility is within our region. We haven't received a request for any assistance and we wouldn't expect to receive one.

LAURA JAYES:

So when you talk about assistance, you're talking about boots on the ground or even any military assets?

PETER DUTTON:

Well again, I mean the Brits and the US in particular, but others in the European Union have provided support to the Ukraine, the so-called ‘lethal aid’ and that support is important, incredibly important, but that's being provided by countries, obviously, that have either a closer proximity to the Ukraine, or have a vested interest in the circumstances as they play out.

At the moment we hope that the deterrence can mean that the Russians step back and that they don't continue on what looks like a path to conflict with Ukraine, because as I say, tens of thousands of people will die, there will be bloody scenes and it hasn't been in our, you know, recent psyche because everyone's been taken over by COVID. But it's not too long ago where we've seen tragic scenes in that part of the world and we want to make sure that they're not repeated. This is a very, very serious situation and Russia really needs to address this issue, the concerns of the international community and obviously, you know, we like anyone else, we condemn any military action.

LAURA JAYES:

Indeed. Australia has just exited, indeed, the West has, the longest war we've ever been involved in and that is Afghanistan. As we see this conflict on the border with Ukraine and Russia. Does the experience of Afghanistan and being involved in a long and protracted war change Australia's thinking about getting involved in another one?

PETER DUTTON:

Well Laura, the circumstances of us going into the Middle East, obviously, were precipitated by the terrorist acts of 9/11. At that time, as we well know, I mean we just didn't know whether there was going to be an attack in Sydney, in Melbourne, in Brisbane, in London, wherever; and so the effort of the West, certainly the Coalition partners, was to defeat that terrorist scourge before it came to our shores. We disrupted a number of terrorist attacks in our own country as a result of our actions in Afghanistan and frankly, in Iraq as well. So the two are quite different, but the UK in particular is, I think, performing a very responsible role in pushing back on Russia and calling them out. I think it's important to call out dictators and people who have aggression as their first instinct. It's unacceptable.

LAURA JAYES:

We are playing a role when it comes to cyber activity. Is there an option for Australia to use offensive cyber-attacks against Russia?

PETER DUTTON:

Well, as Marise Payne has pointed out, she has had conversations with her Ukrainian counterpart and there's going to be a discussion between our Cyber Ambassador here from Australia, with the Ukrainian authorities. If there's a way in which we can provide assistance, we'd be happy to assess that, but it's not something that we would comment on publicly beyond that.

LAURA JAYES:

Okay. The UK’s Liz Truss was here – as you know, you were involved in her visit late last week – she was very forward in talking about aggression from Russia. Russia essentially working hand in glove with China. With those two big powers that obviously don't share democratic values, such as the ones we live by in Australia. Does that represent an escalation in itself? Does that represent a really, I guess, a big problem for Australia and the West?

PETER DUTTON:

Well, I think it's an incredibly worrying development that we see the cyber-attacks on an industrial scale from Russia, from China, from Iran and the economic coercion that we've seen here in Australia and many other countries. I mean Lithuania is under attack at the moment. The Chinese Government is in conflict with the Philippines, with India, with many other countries and if there is a close collaboration between the Chinese and the Russians, then that is a very worrying development.

LAURA JAYES:

Let me ask you about HMAS Adelaide. It is on its way to Tonga to provide aid. When do you expect it to arrive?

PETER DUTTON:

Well hopefully as soon as possible. Obviously, Tonga is very concerned about COVID. There are no cases in Tonga at the moment and they're a vulnerable population. HMAS Adelaide has left with over 600 hundred crew on board, but we do have a situation at the moment where 23 personnel have tested positive for COVID. So we'll work with the Tongan  authorities to keep that vessel at sea, to make sure that there's no threat and obviously, the Tongan Government is discussing that at the moment internally. They need the aid desperately, but they don't want the risk of COVID. So, we'll work through all of that as quickly as we can.

LAURA JAYES:

Well, that's a terrible situation because we don't want to make a vulnerable community even more vulnerable with COVID on board HMAS Adelaide. So does that mean that aid is delayed in getting to Tonga, or are you putting in place other measures?

PETER DUTTON:

No, we've already put aid in through the C-17, through the aircraft, that's important and I think the other point Laura, is that there can be a contactless delivery of much of this equipment as well. So it may mean that HMAS Adelaide is able to dock and provide the support and then we move on from there, but it may mean that they stand off and wait a number of days, but we don't have personnel on the ground. It's a matter of dropping the aid and providing that support, and then hopefully in time we can meet, what's a 21 day quarantine requirement within Tonga at the moment, but we'll work with the authorities as to how we balance those priorities. We're not going to put the Tongan population at risk. At the same time, we want to deliver the aid as quickly as possible.

LAURA JAYES:

We're all watching the tennis at the moment. It was a couple of weeks ago where you rightly criticised some celebrities for not getting behind the treatment of Peng Shuai and giving their voice to that. So, what do you make of the activists and how they were treated at the tennis this week?

PETER DUTTON:

Well obviously, I think in relation to that case where a woman makes a claim of having been sexually assaulted, of having been raped in the year 2021, as it then was, 2022 now, and still we don't have any answers to that as to how the authorities have responded – other than her social media account has been wiped and we really haven't heard a true account. She hasn't departed China. I think it's deeply concerning and I think we should be speaking up about these issues. I'd encourage not just celebrities, but you know, tennis organisations, including Tennis Australia. WTA, I think has been very good in relation to it, but other governments and other bodies, we need to speak as one voice on this. It's a concerning development. It wouldn't be tolerated in any other country and I think we need to really put those human rights focus first and foremost. I think it's important.

LAURA JAYES:

Well Tennis Australia reportedly takes about $25 million a year from Chinese owned companies. Is that just a coincidence?

PETER DUTTON:

I don't see that there's a correlation between it. I think Tennis Australia is an incredibly responsible body. I know Craig Tiley well and have a great deal of respect for him. He's one of the country's greatest administrators of sport, but this is a real concern, an international concern, and we don't want to drag sport into politics, but this is not a political issue, it's a human rights issue and it's frankly, about the treatment of a young woman who is claiming that she has been sexually assaulted, has been raped.

LAURA JAYES:

Indeed. Minister Dutton thanks so much for your time. I appreciate it.

PETER DUTTON:

Thanks Laura.

[ends]